::Attention Artists- Be Aware::

DottyDots Profile Options #1

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Please make sure you read the ToS so you know your rights when dealing with EME. A few of us took a further look into it so we had an understanding further and you can see some conversations about it on other threads.

You have been warned.

TO QUOTE THE ENMASSE TOS:

Any and all User Content submitted to En Masse shall be deemed, and shall remain, the property of En Masse from the moment such User Content is created. En Masse shall exclusively own all now known or hereafter existing copyrights and all other intellectual property rights to all User Content of every kind and nature, in perpetuity throughout the world. To the extent that any of the above may be void or unenforceable, you agree that any and all User Content is hereby irrevocably assigned to En Masse, together with all intellectual property rights therein. To the extent any of the User Content is not assignable, by submitting User Content to En Masse, you agree that En Masse shall be irrevocably entitled, directly or indirectly throughout the world and in perpetuity, to modify, adapt, use, reproduce, license, publish, broadcast, perform, sell, translate, create derivative works from and distribute any User Content for any purpose whatsoever, commercial or otherwise, in any medium now known or hereafter devised, without compensation or credit to the provider or author of the User Content. You also give up any claim that any use by En Masse of any User Content violates any of your rights, including but not limited to moral rights, rights of privacy, rights to publicity, proprietary or other rights, and/or rights to credit for the material or ideas set forth therein.

Spudfuzz Profile Options #2

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"Without compensation or credit to the provider or author of the User Content."

Well, that's just lovely. >_>

I've done fan art of games and other media before, it was no problem to acknowledge the copyright belonged to the company that owned the design/ character, etc but this makes me a bit uneasy. Does that mean if you did fan art and hosted on a different site (such as deviant art) but did not submit it here that it doesn't fall under that clause? Because it said: " User Content submitted to En Masse"

The other question is then, even if you did submit your work here and it now belonged to En Masse, would they even actually modify, distribute, sell, reproduce it or whatever? I mean why would En Masse bother when they have professional artists to hire who could give them much higher quality work? o.O
Taosym Profile Options #3

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Spudfuzz on 05/24/2012, 08:48 PM
"Without compensation or credit to the provider or author of the User Content."

Well, that's just lovely. >_>

I've done fan art of games and other media before, it was no problem to acknowledge the copyright belonged to the company that owned the design/ character, etc but this makes me a bit uneasy. Does that mean if you did fan art and hosted on a different site (such as deviant art) but did not submit it here that it doesn't fall under that clause? Because it said: " User Content submitted to En Masse"

The other question is then, even if you did submit your work here and it now belonged to En Masse, would they even actually modify, distribute, sell, reproduce it or whatever? I mean why would En Masse bother when they have professional artists to hire who could give them much higher quality work? o.O


This is so En Masse can take ideas posted here on the forums, and legally use them and put them into their game.

This is to stop things like a guy who posted an idea that Blizzard later implimented into WoW, and he later tried to sue them for not crediting him.
Forge7PhD Profile Options #4

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Also all fan art typically belongs to the IP copyright holder regardless.
DottyDots Profile Options #5

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Forge7PhD on 05/24/2012, 09:17 PM - view
Also all fan art typically belongs to the IP copyright holder regardless.


This issue came to light because of a PM that was going on between me and another artist on the forums. I messaged forum support to find out about my rights to one image and was linked back the ToS with an attitude from EME that I just had to buck it up.

Now if this is incorrect- I welcome it to be set straight by an EME employee.
DottyDots Profile Options #6

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If anyone sees anything else in the ToS worth noting, please mention it in here. Thank you!
Edited by: DottyDots 12 months ago
Leiloni Profile Options #7

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This is pretty standard.
pipedreams Profile Options #8

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WARNING, I THIS IS JUST ME SMASHING ALL OF MY POSTS FROM MY ART THREAD ( NOW CLOSED ) RELATED THIS MATTER INTO ONE PLACE FOR REFERENCE.

To quote some of my other posts concerning this:

pipedreams on 05/23/2012, 12:29 PM
Hello everyone, I am sorry to say but as I have become aware of something extremely horrifying in the terms of my Intellectual Property, that EME runs itself by, I am no longer comfortable posting forum sigs or any other kind of artwork I make on these forums, let along participating in them much anymore. to those of you who were waiting, I am sorry but with this TOS, I am not okay with continuing to have graphics I put my creative effrorts into being used on these forums. ( The ones i made using 100% my own graphics, the ones I made using Tera images belong to them anyways. )

Anyone who is already using something I made, please feel free to continue using it as I have already lost my IP rights to it, according to this TOS.

To me, this is just a [filtered] up policy that I cannot agree to, regardless of if it ever directly effects me or not.

TO QUOTE THE ENMASSE TOS:

Any and all User Content submitted to En Masse shall be deemed, and shall remain, the property of En Masse from the moment such User Content is created. En Masse shall exclusively own all now known or hereafter existing copyrights and all other intellectual property rights to all User Content of every kind and nature, in perpetuity throughout the world. To the extent that any of the above may be void or unenforceable, you agree that any and all User Content is hereby irrevocably assigned to En Masse, together with all intellectual property rights therein. To the extent any of the User Content is not assignable, by submitting User Content to En Masse, you agree that En Masse shall be irrevocably entitled, directly or indirectly throughout the world and in perpetuity, to modify, adapt, use, reproduce, license, publish, broadcast, perform, sell, translate, create derivative works from and distribute any User Content for any purpose whatsoever, commercial or otherwise, in any medium now known or hereafter devised, without compensation or credit to the provider or author of the User Content. You also give up any claim that any use by En Masse of any User Content violates any of your rights, including but not limited to moral rights, rights of privacy, rights to publicity, proprietary or other rights, and/or rights to credit for the material or ideas set forth therein.


pipedreams on 05/24/2012, 05:46 PM
Yes, to those who asked, it flatly says that the moment you post any and all kinds of media, it belongs to them 100% no questions asked.

Many services out there have terms similar to this. For the most part, their intent is to legally allow them to display the IP of an individual on their website, and in some cases make automatic changes to it without infringing any IP rights. ( Such as images auto-compressing and resizing, in places like facebook. )

However, here is an example of ( more or less ) what MOST TOS clauses I have seen look like concerning this, listed in key points:

- You keep your IP/Copyright to your media
- You grant the company a royalty-free license to post, use, redistribute, and create derivatives of your media
- When you delete your media ( and it is cleared from all cache/current backups ) the license you extended to them expires

Here is what EME Says:

- When you post it, you give up ALL of your IP/Copyright to the media ( current rights, or ones you may attempt to obtain on the media in the future. IE: If you decide you want to officially copyright your drawing next week, you forfeit it to EME. ) WORLD WIDE. Forever.
- They can use your media for any reason they see fit. They can use it to make money, they can make derivative works, they can redistribute it if they want to, and they can do so without ever having to notify, credit, or pay you for anything because you no longer own the thing that you posted in any kind of way.
- No matter what happens, EME still owns what you have posted. Forever. All over the world. Even if the contract goes void, they still own it and you do not own it ever again. Ever.
- If anything we do with your work upsets you for any reason, too bad, so sad, it ours now and [filtered] you.


pipedreams on 05/25/2012, 12:35 PM
"Any and all User Content submitted to En Masse " this part of it leads me to believe that it only belongs to them if you post it on any kind of official En Masse service/space. So, posting on DA or any other place other than a place owned and operated by EME, should be safe.


Also, please keep in mind that bumping threads ( or posting for only the sake of bringing the thread to the top ) is not allowed on these forums.
Edited by: pipedreams 12 months ago
Travail Profile Options #9

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To my eyes, that entire TOS is void right from the first sentence. You have not "submitted" anything to En Masse, not if you haven't uploaded it to this website, or specifically given them a copy of your work, say, in an e-mail, or as a part of some contest. Uploading an image to a site like Photobucket or DeviantArt, then linking it here, is not "submitting" that image to En Masse. You are linking something from another site, they can't claim any rights to that work.

-Travail.
Edited by: Travail 12 months ago
pipedreams Profile Options #10

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Travail on 05/25/2012, 02:50 PM - view
To my eyes, that entire TOS is void right from the first sentence. You have not "submitted" anything to En Masse, not if you haven't uploaded it to this website, or specifically given them a copy of your work, say, in an e-mail, or as a part of some contest. Uploading an image to a site like Photobucket or DeviantArt, then linking it here, is not "submitting" that image to En Masse. You are linking something from another site, they can't claim any rights to that work.

-Travail.


I had been wondering about that, myself. But, in any case I still do not agree with the way this clause is expressed at all. Either way, I think think it is a good idea for artists to be aware of clauses like these, before they go posting their stuff up.

But, how can we be sure if it is void or not? What happened to the OP was they had designed their guild banner, and psoted it on the forums. Then someone else used it in some dramallama stuff =, defacing it, and they wanted it removed from the forums in such a state. So, I suggested they contact a GM to ask that it be removed, as this was their IP and they had not given permission for it to be used. In response, the GM quoted the first bit of this TOS clause, and then told them to deal with it.

According to this GM, the OP gave up their IP by posting it on the forums, regardless of where it is posted?? That makes no sense at all.
Edited by: pipedreams 12 months ago