Against posting game-ruining topics.

DrakeDragon Profile Options #61

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BigNasty on 04/03/2012, 04:34 PM - view
DrakeDragon on 04/03/2012, 04:31 PM
exactly, things are so simple to figure out, there really is no need for guides, if people respect the game and actually like it, they will willingly take the time to READ about it on the website, or ingame, playing and figuring it all out....not hard is it?


Most people won't even look at these "guides" dude and they will be better players for it.


yep and i agree 100% and some people will make false guides and have their friends say its good to have people mess up.

well im sure you will be one of the top players especially if you don't follow guides.

@VenomPhoenix stop with the threats.

and stop putting words in my mouth, i never said anything is wrong with taking advice, so please leave me alone.
VenomPhoenix Profile Options #62

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DrakeDragon on 04/03/2012, 05:33 PM - view
BigNasty on 04/03/2012, 04:34 PM
DrakeDragon on 04/03/2012, 04:31 PM
exactly, things are so simple to figure out, there really is no need for guides, if people respect the game and actually like it, they will willingly take the time to READ about it on the website, or ingame, playing and figuring it all out....not hard is it?


Most people won't even look at these "guides" dude and they will be better players for it.


yep and i agree 100% and some people will make false guides and have their friends say its good to have people mess up.

well im sure you will be one of the top players especially if you don't follow guides.

@VenomPhoenix stop with the threats.

and stop putting words in my mouth, i never said anything is wrong with taking advice, so please leave me alone.


I never threatened you.

As for false guides, having them posted on a community forums actually PREVENTS that. But this thread of yours doesnt like logic does it?

No top player reads no guides. Top players do not just do whatever they think is best and hope to come out on top. They use whatever means is necessary to improve themselves.

Back when i played WoW i ranked as an affliciton warlock. Best of horde on server, but some locks on alliance side had a few more heroics than i did. I was always looking for new input. I would spend DAYS in front of dummies practicing rotations and trying new ideas.

Community based guides are a collection of generally accepted advice. I dont know where you got this idea that guides have ONE build that you MUST use and there are NO alternatives. Look at the good old drain vs. bolt argument for locks. Drain was undoubtedly better IF you had perfect ( and i mean damn perfect) timing. But bolt was generally the one people used because it was more consistent and less prone to latency issues.

Guides are just that, a guide.

It is up to you to decide what to do with the information. Knowledge truly is power in RPGs, and there is nothign wrong with sharing it with the community/seeking it out.

I dont know why you are against the free exchange of ideas about a class on a community class forum. But hey, you seem to have this preconception that guides are bad and evil, and i am not sure that anything will convince you otherwise.
Edited by: VenomPhoenix about 1 year ago
DrakeDragon Profile Options #63

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[quote name='VenomPhoenix' at='04/03/2012, 05:43 PM'][quote name='DrakeDragon' at='04/03/2012, 05:33 PM'][quote name='BigNasty' at='04/03/2012, 04:34 PM'][quote name='DrakeDragon' at='04/03/2012, 04:31 PM']exactly, things are so simple to figure out, there really is no need for guides, if people respect the game and actually like it, they will willingly take the time to READ about it on the website, or ingame, playing and figuring it all out....not hard is it?[/quote]


no offense, you obviously haven't played games as long as me or bignasty have, i never followed any guides for Diablo 2, was one of top players, never followed guides for UO, was TOP player on my server, 3rd over all.

don't think top players all read guides because most don't, most of the top players, MAKE guides.....
enso Profile Options #64

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OP your entitled to your opinion, how about you play the game you want to play and let others play the game they want to play that way we don't need to freak out or have police telling people how to play an MMO? It is a game, your not saving the world -- move on. Thank you this has been IMO.
VenomPhoenix Profile Options #65

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DrakeDragon on 04/03/2012, 06:01 PM - view

no offense, you obviously haven't played games as long as me or bignasty have, i never followed any guides for Diablo 2, was one of top players, never followed guides for UO, was TOP player on my server, 3rd over all.

don't think top players all read guides because most don't, most of the top players, MAKE guides.....


"stop talking, you are not as 1337 as i am".

Really?

Anyway, you can think what you want about all that, its still no reason to ban guides on this forum.
DrakeDragon Profile Options #66

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VenomPhoenix on 04/03/2012, 06:05 PM - view
DrakeDragon on 04/03/2012, 06:01 PM

no offense, you obviously haven't played games as long as me or bignasty have, i never followed any guides for Diablo 2, was one of top players, never followed guides for UO, was TOP player on my server, 3rd over all.

don't think top players all read guides because most don't, most of the top players, MAKE guides.....


"stop talking, you are not as 1337 as i am".

Really?

Anyway, you can think what you want about all that, its still no reason to ban guides on this forum.


i never once used the word "Ban" stop suggesting i did, and no i'm not saying im more "1337" then anyone, just pointing out, you don't need to follow guides to be good at a game, stop suggesting to people that you do.

@Enso hey i stated in my original post, that if people wanna do that, so be it, just saying, that people who follow guides arent the only good players, but if you take the word of someone like phoenix, ONLY good players use guides?

@Phoenix, stop putting words in my mouth, stop using libeling statements, i've already talked to the GM's about YOUR! behavior, so please stop posting lies, and libeling statements, that mislead others.

Helpful advice, i'm ALL FOR! not against!

i'm against Stuck up guide makers who think only guide followers are decent players. is that clear enough? if you think people who don't follow guides suck, then you're the type of person i'm against, guides do not equal good players.

good players are helpful, give advice when asked, and are able to help all types of players.

Bad players are the ones who tell people "just follow this guide" or call other people noobs/trash/losers.

not everyone wants to follow guides, don't tell people to follow them, you can mention them, don't tell them to follow them.

is this direct enough?

example.

player1:hey i'm sort of new, could you help me with a few things?
Player2: dude just follow a guide or something.

^ that is a BAD player.

Player1:Hey i'm sort of new, could you help me with a few things?
Player2: i don't mind, whats up?

^ Good player.

can't get much clearer then that.
VenomPhoenix Profile Options #67

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DrakeDragon on 04/03/2012, 06:48 PM - view

i'm against Stuck up guide makers who think only guide followers are decent players. is that clear enough? if you think people who don't follow guides suck, then you're the type of person i'm against, guides do not equal good players.


Your whole OP is about how bad guides are.

Guides =/= one build to rule them all.

Like i said, you have this misconception that guides are bad, and have given no reason.

A player linking someone a guide is not a bad player, it just saves time having to retype the same basic stuff over and over and over again.

So you want to be super cool and not use guides and be the best you can be without anyone elses input. Fine. Stop trying to force that kind of mechanic on others.

Having communal guides allows new players to get their bearings, learn known successful strategies, and gives a good foundation to build on. There is nothing bad about it.

If the kind of people you associate with say "you must follow this guide exactly or you are a bad player", then that is the fault of the people you associate with, not with the concept of guides itself.

Lay blame where blame is merited.

Also, i honestly dont care about how much you complain to GMs/mods about me. If you have a legitimate complaint, raise it and be done with it. I dont see the need for you to TELL me that you are "dobbing me in".
DrakeDragon Profile Options #68

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VenomPhoenix on 04/03/2012, 07:08 PM - view


Your whole OP is about how bad guides are.


Guides are bad to follow ---- that is true for the following reasons.

You limit yourself and gamestyle if you follow them
You are taking someones elses advice at heart, before attempting something yourself.
Every guide has a counter part, which means you are setting yourself up for an automatic failure.

Advice, tips, and hints are GOOD to accept ------That is true for the following reasons.

Advice is given when you ask specific questions, you get specific answers.
Tips can help ease your frustration, and you make friends this way, by interacting.
Hints are good to get, it doesn't solve the puzzle for you, but helps you solve, also improves brain activity. --argue that?

Guides are good for the following reasons.

People who are generally trying to help, get to help a lot of people at one time, and most posters are always willing to take ADVICE.
People who are completely lost, and aren't able to move forward can turn to these to help them.
After making a few characters designed after your personality, you want a rounded off good character to be helpful on harder raids if your other characters arent up to par.


Advice, tips, and hints are bad to accept ------That is true for the following reasons.

Relying on people too much, will slow your brain activity, and you will get in the habbit of always requesting help.
Some tips, or hints may be spoilers for things to come (Not always true for all games)
Some hints may make a person feel inadequate, because of the phrases people may use. Example "it's common sense dude".


These aren't the only pros/cons of the two things, i just did quick ones.

did i make my point now? there is nothing wrong with interacting with someone, some people may not have strong enough computers to have a browser and the game open at the same time, others just might not enjoy having the lag that it can sometimes cause, it is far better to simply answer a person then sending them on a hunt for a guide, it is also a great way to create hunting buddies.
Edited by: DrakeDragon about 1 year ago
Koltan Profile Options #69

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Koltan on 04/03/2012, 12:19 AM - view
Whenever I play an MMO, I always try to figure out how things work for my character. I take the time to look at what each skill does, what skills works with what, and so forth.

When you get to something you don't understand, some guides are out there to help you understand them more easily, whether it be the entire class, or one part of it. Not all guides are out there to make you into another look alike, just there to get you on the right track if you wish to try it. Some guides don't have to be followed all the way, as I have learned from previous experiences in warcraft (took some ideas from the guide, mixed in my own, and I created even better numbers.). Some people prefer to treat it like a code because they believe it to be dead on accurate. The warrior fury dps Spreadsheet from cataclysm comes to mind. That's fine, so long as they don't belittle you because they see you doing something different (that is called abuse by the way, and is usually not tolerated in games).

Sure, there is creativity when you try to do things your own way. Problem is, if it doesn't produce results, you're going to get some heat, or some tips, depending on how friendly those you are with are.


Quoting my own post from page two of this thread, as well as a few revisions to it. I think you may have missed it.

DrakeDragon Profile Options #70

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Koltan on 04/03/2012, 07:29 PM - view


Quoting my own post from page two of this thread, as well as a few revisions to it. I think you may have missed it.



i saw it, i enjoyed reading it very much, it was well put together, and i agree, if a build doesn't produce results, some players may give you heat, others will give you advice, or offer to simply help if you decide to make a new character, the helpful players are the ones i consider good players, and i'm hoping there are at least a ratio of 6-1 for good players against rotten apples.