Casual v/s Hardcore

Guyon_delsho Profile Options #31

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OP, I would very much like to buy you a beer.

As to the Eq1 question. I am sitting in a chair, right now, 12 years after EQ1, wishing with every ounce of my being, that someone would make a game that fostered the kind of community I enjoyed in EQ1. A community that was built, in it's very core, on two very basic concepts.

1. You need to work as a team to do anything of any worth.
2. Screwing up and dying was something to be avoided, not simply an inconvenience.



Did I complain about death penalities in EQ1? Sure I did, Corpse runs were horrid when I was a warrior. Having to keep a set of extra armor to go fetch my actual armor? yeah, that was god awful. Needing a group for everything was a pain in the neck.....

But if I knew the cost of losing those things? I would have shut my mouth in a heartbeat and praised Verant for their vision.
ReiKoji Profile Options #32

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For a game they expect people to continue to pay for every month, it is wise to cater to all types of players. Sub-less games it doesnt matter. You buy them, you play them, you beat them, hopefully they have some kind of multiplayer or other re-play value like higher difficulty modes (MGS, Ninja Gaiden, Etc). But these types of games are the only games where only the developers desires matter. Never changing or adapting in a subscription based-game, aka MMO, will lead that MMO to either death, or a ghostly exsistance.
Edited by: ReiKoji 11 months ago
willicus Profile Options #33

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Kunae on 06/11/2012, 02:00 PM - view

First off, there are not hundreds of MMORPGs on the market, and there are not more released every day.

I never said there were, but if you want to narrow the consumer base we're discussing to people whose monetary choices are only between MMOs, then your argument gets even weaker.

Kunae on 06/11/2012, 02:00 PM - view

If your game is the same game as everyone else has made, why should anyone play yours? I am positive you are well acquainted with this saying: "Build strength through diversity"; It actually holds true, in reference to the MMORPG market, as a whole.


Look at the forum you're on. Look at the argument you're making. You are upset because you feel as if every MMO is catering to its community, leading to a lack of diversity. I am also not entirely pleased about it, but that's beside the point.

The reason people whine and complain and make requests for changes to game mechanics, fluff, or functionality are because they want the same game in a new skin. They want to have the experience of discovering the first game they loved, and then got bored of, or lost due to a dying population.

So why should anyone play yours, you ask? Because you're giving them a chance to relive their amazing experience in that generic, similar game, with new sights to see. You give them an opportunity for discovery. You give them a way to play through the same content, updated for modern engines and times.

People don't want different.
Underverse Profile Options #34

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Carolius on 06/11/2012, 01:51 PM - view
One of the biggest things I have noticed about MMO's nowadays is you don't get attached to your toons. It's just too damn easy to get to max level and get them equipped. Everyone wants "one of everything".

Using DAoC as an example. I was a Hib druid. I spent a f-ton of time on that toon. If you were a max level who even put his pinkey toe into Emain Macha you knew my name, you knew the 5-6 guy I ran with on a nightly basis, and you knew I could heal FOREVER. I loved, loved, loved that toon and by default, that game. I had a champ also but he wasn't even ballpark to my druid.

I hear Lineage was the same way. You put so much time into one toon that people just couldn't give it up. People played that game forever. Aion was/is the same way. WOW was also the same until they started spammin out new content. I loved my hunter and put a fair amount of effort into it. My buddy talked me into trying Cata. When the first mob I killed dropped a green with better stats than my LK crossbow I shut the game down and quit it forever.

I honestly don't know how they can find a happy medium again. Take SWOTR. My guild completely finished that game in like a month and a half. They can't possibly put out enough content to keep "hardcores" happy.


^ Truth.

I haven't played WoW in almost a year and I still go look at my toons online. I spent so many years on that damn pally I almost feel empty without it. I think logging back into that game in it's current state would make me feel even more empty, though. I heard what they did to the skill trees. Just another example of how stupidity is applauded and even rewarded in this day and age.

It felt good to stand in Shatt or Org and watch people stop just to drool over your gear and the amount of time and effort you put into getting it.

Now it's just "How much did you pay for that?"

Or the feeling you got when Prince finally went down for the first time ever, after weeks and weeks of trying.

We killed everything in SWTOR without ever breaking a sweat, and before the first month was up.



Gallus Profile Options #35

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This is funny, a crybaby thread about people crying too much. Interesting.

I'm an older guy too and I clearly remember people on Forums posting complaints, proposing changes, make making similar posts to the one the OP made, and that was all before online games even had graphics.

I remember the DF, IoK and LoK MUD forums had people QQing up a storm every day.

In any case, your NFL comparison isn't valid because people who've been playing football for 30 days aren't thrown into the arena with NFL super stars that have been playing football for 20+ years of their life, half of which on a professional level.

Your comparison would only be valid if Tera had 2 types of servers (One for Normal Players and one for Professional gamers only, the professional one would have to be invite only of course)
Mangix Profile Options #36

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Its happened to almost every game across the board, I can't really name a single one that isn't a 5 day to capped/geared process.

It really is quite sad, its like seeing your pet start limping because his hips are old and then he goes blind.

Secret World looks bland as hell.
Guild Wars 2 isn't terrible, I enjoyed it a bit this weekend, but its casual to the extreme.
I'm not really holding out hopes for Elder Scrolls Online.
In fact I'm not really holding out hopes for any game to save the genre. I think our goose is cooked gentlemen.

I'm debating whether or not to just buy a [filtered] load of single player steam games and leave the genre be forever.
Edited by: Mangix 11 months ago
willicus Profile Options #37

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Mangix on 06/11/2012, 02:27 PM - view

I'm debating whether or not to just buy a [filtered] load of single player steam games and leave the genre be forever.


My girlfriend always asks why I buy so many Steam games that I never play. It's certainly not just because they're on sale for $4.00.
JamesX Profile Options #38

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Stop treating MMORPG as an MMO. Just treat it a single player game that you can occasionally play with friends. Might end up happier =X
Mangix Profile Options #39

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willicus on 06/11/2012, 02:29 PM - view
Mangix on 06/11/2012, 02:27 PM

I'm debating whether or not to just buy a [filtered] load of single player steam games and leave the genre be forever.


My girlfriend always asks why I buy so many Steam games that I never play. It's certainly not just because they're on sale for $4.00.


I havent even played half the games I own, I just buy them in some false hope that it will cure my boredom and disagreement with the way things are going. Perhaps respark some old love I had for gaming.

When I moved 2 years ago I didn't bring my computer with me, I had no gaming for almost a year before I decided to make one. I almost hate the fact that I did. I was a much happier individual tbh. Not so much because gaming makes me angry or whatever, moreso just because I didn't think about gaming, or my distaste for it in its current state. It didn't apply to me because I couldn't play it anyways.

Then swtor came around and "I HAD TO HAVE A MACHINE TO PLAY IT" or so I was told. I [filtered] hate everyone who tricked me into buying that game and making a comp for it. They should all suffer. lol.
Edited by: Mangix 11 months ago
Gallus Profile Options #40

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Underverse on 06/11/2012, 02:15 PM - view
One of the biggest things I have noticed about MMO's nowadays is you don't get attached to your toons. It's just too damn easy to get to max level and get them equipped. Everyone wants "one of everything"


I don't understand, you think connecting to your toon results from difficulty in getting gear? Tera, aside from getting the gear itself, you can lux them, lock in the bonuses you want, enchant it to +12.... Doing that twice, once for PVE and once of PVP gear....

The amount of hours to do all of that is pretty high for an MMO. You saying that you did all that and you thought it was too easy so you didn't connect with your toon?