terminology and you

Angrynixon Profile Options #31

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@Jessmo: Not sure how you could use DPS as a useful measuring tool separating out burst and sustained.

As a poster on a previous page mentioned though you can't use DPS as the final measure of worth in a vacuum.
Edited by: Angrynixon about 1 year ago
Shrug Profile Options #32

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Thundercat on 05/14/2012, 06:25 AM - view


burst damage does not need to be calculated over 'seconds' because it isnt sustained, its immediate in one hit.


I'm not sure if you're new to MMO's, but your fundamental understanding of what burst DPS is is wrong. Burst DPS is not a single hit. When a class has high burst dps it's generally referring to abilities that have a long cooldown, or high cost, but do great damage over a short time.

Edited by: Shrug about 1 year ago
Jessmo Profile Options #33

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Jessmosis Lvl.60
Tempest Reach (PVE)
Elin Archer
Depending on how long the fight is how accurate it can be measured using DPS. I can see burst damage being measured on BAMs and it being pretty accurate, not so much on the normal mobs.
Mash Profile Options #34

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This thread is frankly a whole lot of semantical gibberish.

Sustained damage and burst damage are only distinguished in short fights, like trash pulls. Let me elaborate.

Burst damage is typically seen when a player has several hard-hitting abilities that are on significant cooldowns. Large bursts of damage. Then, the damage decreases significantly until the cooldowns are up.

The only time that even matters is on fights where the mob dies before those cooldowns have a chance to come up.

On long, extended fights, the drop in DPS during cooldowns is averaged out with the bursts of spike damage. It evens out after a period of time.

If you are on a boss fight that lasts 60 seconds, and you have abilities that hit hard, and are all on 15 second cooldowns, then you will do 4 bursts of damage, which will even out with the 4-5 drops in DPS.

If the classes are properly balanced, then burst classes can compete just fine with the sustained classes. The sustained damage classes will never be able to hit as hard as the burst, but they will hit more often. Contrarily, the burst don't hit as often, but they hit much harder.

This is nothing new, and it boils down to class balance, not burst versus sustained.
Komisho Profile Options #35

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Billy is a Burst DPS, Billy uses his attack that takes 10 seconds to use and does 10k damage. This means that Billy had a 1k DPS.

Joe is a Sustained DPS, Joe hits the monster 10 times in 10 seconds for 1k per hit. This means that Joe also had a 1k DPS.

What's so hard to understand about this? DPS is a measure of damage output over time, by time I mean one second. Considering this fact, if Billy did two attacks within 20 seconds, and Joe continued with his sustained DPS, they would still in fact have the same DPS because they still output the same damage over time, the time being 20 seconds.

You seem to absolutely hate the idea of a burst damage dealing class being called burst DPS, but that's what it is. Any damage dealer will in fact be considered DPS as that is their role in the fight, and because when it comes down to it, DPS is what measures up how much damage a person can/will do in a certain time frame, or if they're under preforming or doing well. I'm a noob to most extents, but even I understand this.

On another note completely, I play a slayer and it is my personal opinion that they don't feel like burst DPS after level 20, because with a few glyphs you're almost always hitting the monster with skills due to cooldown procs. This is just my opinion, but the only class I consider burst at this point is a beserker.
Edited by: Komisho about 1 year ago
Mash Profile Options #36

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Komisho on 05/14/2012, 07:54 AM - view
Billy is a Burst DPS, Billy uses his attack that takes 10 seconds to use and does 10k damage. This means that Billy had a 1k DPS.

Joe is a Sustained DPS, Joe hits the monster 10 times in 10 seconds for 1k per hit. This means that Joe also had a 1k DPS.

What's so hard to understand about this? DPS is a measure of damage output over time, by time I mean one second. Considering this fact, if Billy did two attacks within 20 seconds, and Joe continued with his sustained DPS, they would still in fact have the same DPS because they still output the same damage over time, the time being 20 seconds.

You seem to absolutely hate the idea of a burst damage dealing class being caled burst DPS, but that's what it is. Any damage dealer will in fact be considered DPS as that is their role in the fight, and because when it comes down to it, DPS is what measures up how much damage a person can/will do in a certain time frame, or if they're under preforming or doing well. I'm a noob to most extents, but even I understand this.

On another note completely, I play a slayer and it is my personal opinion that they don't feel like burst DPS after level 20, because with a few glyphs you're almost always hitting the monster with skills due to cooldown procs. This is just my opinion, but the only class I consider burst at this point is a beserker.


Thank you. I'm glad to see that at least you understand what the role is.

And on another note, I have a 60 Slayer. We are not burst. Berserkers can hit much, much harder than us, but have less frequent abilities. We have no charge-ups, and not many big cooldowns.

There is always another skill to throw in.

We are definitely not burst.
Dracus Profile Options #37

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DPS measurements depend entirely on the time interval used to determine DPS. Most DPS meters use shorter intervals to measure DPS as opposed to Damage.

DPS classes are normally considered to be high damage dealers who do CONSISTENT damage over time regardless of the time interval used.

High damage classes are also high damage dealers by their DPS can be very inconsistent based on the time interval used.

For instance, at times in WoW when Affliction locks were buffed/not nerfed, their DoTs were back loaded and did more damage at the end of their cast. In short fights against weaker NPC an Affliction Warlock would do lousy DPS because targets would die before most of their spells did most of their damage. But in a Boss fight they were extremely valuable because their spells would run the full course several times and they could end with the highest total damage in the fight.

So most groups wanted a dependable high DPS class for breezing through normal opponents and elites but wanted to be sure they had a high Damage class as well for boss fights.
rocdog Profile Options #38

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What if we called it "average hit points removed per hour"? Would that work? Seconds and hours are just units of measurement. You pick a numerator and a denominator. As long as they are used consistently, it doesn't matter which you choose.

Burst damage matters when you want to inflict more damage than can be avoided or mitigated or shielded against or healed in a very short period of time, like in 1v1 PvP. That's pretty much the main situation when you want to focus on burst damage. It doesn't matter if you are OOM or half dead yourself at the end of the fight, as long as the enemy is dead before you are.
Pinupgirl Profile Options #39

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Burst is only relevant if you need to kill something extremely fast.

Sustained DPS is only relevant if you have all the time in the world to do an optimal rotaiton.


If overall one class grossly outperforms another then that's a balance issue and should be addressed as such.
Lucroarna Profile Options #40

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No one can count how much damage you do on a boss, if they are, they care too much. The boss dying is what matters. Honestly don't argue about this, and just don't play with people who are going to be elitist with their own imaginary numbers they come up with to bring you down.

Honestly though, that's not even elitist. That's just crackhead MMO players who think they're all 50 cent up in here.