Quote: Aielith on 06/12/2012, 10:57 AM

my argument is that sorcerer and zerkers can come very close to one shotting someone that is a fact and if you want more control it has to come at a price you are free to disagree with that arument but dont make up things i havent said lets be more honest

That dps potential you speak of ALREADY comes at a steep price. IE - requiring multiple abilities chained together all while being rooted in place while casting long drawn out animations.

Those factors are negligible in PvE combat since the computer enemy AI is dumb and you don't have a slayer or warrior in your face stunlocking and knocking you down nonstop before you can ever get thru that chain of casting and get off that fireblast..

In PvP all that dps potential get thrown out the window. Movement is to chaotic/random and people aren't stupid enough to stand there and let you fire off 5 spells and wait all patiently in the big orange circle for you to nuke them.

It might not be that bad if our CC was actually on par with the CC other classes get. But sadly that's not the case. If it's not outright dodged they can easily use a skill to negate it completely. So either they need to increase the viablity of our CC or increase our mobility or decrease the casting times or the root effect... something... anything.

I didn't roll a sorc so I'd be viable solely in open world zerg situations that only occur at nexus since there's absolutely no incentive for that type of pvp. It'd be nice if the class was viable for BG's and smaller scale pvp too like every other class. I don't think that's asking much.

i am all for sorcerers getting more control but it has to be done carefully as they can already pretty much insta gib someone given the right conditions

Quote: Aielith on 06/12/2012, 12:06 PM

i am all for sorcerers getting more control but it has to be done carefully as they can already pretty much insta gib someone given the right conditions

Well obviously it should be done carefully but unfortunately I don't have much faith in this dev team at this point. Case in point: the incoming Warrior buffs which will surely make them the new FOTM class and OP as hell.

That said, I'm more interested to hear your definition of "insta gib someone"... what exactly does that mean here in regards to a sorc?

Also please define "the right conditions" because I'm pretty sure "the right conditions" only exist in PvE combat.

Like I said, for a sorc the "right conditions" are limited to only open world zerg fests where they can hide behind their friendly line and wait for their teammates to stun/leash someone so they can maybe catch them with a fireball before they evade. And even here given the "right conditions" sorc's are STILL DEPENDENT on their other teammates to setup the possibility of them being able to get off all that DPS to 'gib' someone.

Other classes don't have this limitation and dependency. Do slayers require anyone to protect them and setup opponents for them so they can utilize their DPS? Nope. What are they sacrificing exactly for all their utility? They have the best of everything with none of the drawbacks or limitations.

What kind of game design is this? So what, I have to re-roll a Slayer if I want to be invited to do BG's and be competitive in pvp? Or maybe EME expects me to level up one of every class to 60 that way I can play whichever class is the most OP on a patch to patch basis. I've been down this road to many times to keep wasting time and money. They got until GW2 comes out to keep my attention. If GW2 drops the ball as badly as Tera they won't last long either but at least I won't be paying a sub to play that game.

It's just pathetic to see these developers keep making the same mistakes over and over again. Shouldn't they be learning from other MMO's mistakes instead of repeating them? I feel like I'm taking crazy pills lol.

Like I said, for a sorc the "right conditions" are limited to only open world zerg fests where they can hide behind their friendly line and wait for their teammates to stun/leash someone so they can maybe catch them with a fireball before they evade. And even here given the "right conditions" sorc's are STILL DEPENDENT on their other teammates to setup the possibility of them being able to get off all that DPS to 'gib' someone.

Other classes don't have this limitation and dependency. Do slayers require anyone to protect them and setup opponents for them so they can utilize their DPS? Nope. What are they sacrificing exactly for all their utility? They have the best of everything with none of the drawbacks or limitations.

Quote: TotallyNotBroc on 06/12/2012, 01:04 PM

Like I said, for a sorc the "right conditions" are limited to only open world zerg fests where they can hide behind their friendly line and wait for their teammates to stun/leash someone so they can maybe catch them with a fireball before they evade. And even here given the "right conditions" sorc's are STILL DEPENDENT on their other teammates to setup the possibility of them being able to get off all that DPS to 'gib' someone.

Other classes don't have this limitation and dependency. Do slayers require anyone to protect them and setup opponents for them so they can utilize their DPS? Nope. What are they sacrificing exactly for all their utility? They have the best of everything with none of the drawbacks or limitations.

Feel free to read the last 7 or so pages of this thread for counter-arguments to all that. Not even going to bother getting into it again with a new party.

Feel free to read the last 7 or so pages of this thread for counter-arguments to all that. Not even going to bother getting into it again with a new party.

You can up your damage with a furious crystal just fine. I have full t12 pvp gear at +8. A sorc just today crit me for 45k with a sped up fireblast that I missed the dodge on. We were both under 50%, so I had 40% reduction and he was using a +8 BT disc. With a pvp weapon, that would have been about 50k. I doubt t13 will make that big a dent when you also get a +12 weapon to go with it.

There are also a number of sorcs in each of those threads saying they can compete equally against most if not all classes.

MentalRiot, the first poster in the thread is a fully pvp geared 60 sorc on JC who I regularly see outside kanstria/zulfikar pvping. He was saying he only had problems with slayers.

Frye is a sorc from Die for Honor, you've probably heard of them being from BC. I believe they were your server's top guild before they transferred. Frye said that he feels sorcs are on of the best 1v1 classes in the game.

And then we have you, who has a completely reversed idea of high level group pvp and gets 3 shot by warriors (1 of those shots being backstab, an extremely low damage move for wars).

I'll leave it to you to guess who's opinions I'll stick with.

And yes, I'm a warrior. He started casting something after an ice needle, no circle appeared so I assumed it was a quick mindblast and hit dfa since dodge was on cd from a lock on, turns out it was fireblast and I couldn't do anything about it since I'm locked into a landing animation. Such is life in a world of split second decisions.

Warriors have about 53-54k hp without hp crystals, so that is only about a 4-5k difference as far as when 50% crystals start to take over. About as much as one non-crit. Hardly anything to point out.

I'd like to see a 50k heart thrust. I believe the fury strike since once they hit under 20% it starts being pretty nasty.