Reflect damage and PvP

noctred Profile Options #91

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xDavo420x on 06/11/2012, 02:52 PM - view

Have never run into a priest I couldn't kill. Warrior here.


Generally speaking, the only priests you're going to kill as a warrior are those who are undergeared relative to you, or those who get cocky and fail to keep themselves topped off because they underestimate potential warrior burst.

As a priest, I think I've only ever lost a duel to a warrior one time - and both of the above conditions applied; he outgeared me and I got a little cocky towards the end, got caught in a well-timed stun, and lost. That same warrior never beat me again.

If priests with decent DR gear are easy for you to kill, I really don't know WTF they're doing. Probably forgot to put guardian sanctuary on their bars?
xDavo420x Profile Options #92

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lol I dunno. And I don't actively fight priests. I don't mean to sound like I can take everything, I was frustrated with the person I was responding to.

I've fought 6 or 7 priests, and killed all but one who got away from me like it was nothing. To add to that, it was a gank scenario, not a duel. And 2 of them got one shotted with scythe for literally sitting there (both of them) while I built edge, laughing at me in chat like I didn't have a Scythe skill coming.

My point is, I will NEVER be able to kill a priest now, no matter how good I am vs. how bad they are.

Something like that has no place in a skill-based PvP game.

And yeah yeah, I know this game wasn't originally made for PvP, but the PvP in it is damn good and I enjoyed it up until this stat hit the battlefield.

*Edit* Also, I would like to add I have, admittedly, never fought a priest since the 30% gear started going around. I can see how they are probably impossible to kill now, but the difference is, if this stat didn't exist, you would not kill yourself trying. It would most likely end in a stalemate with one person or the other running off. Now you will flat out die trying.
Edited by: xDavo420x 11 months ago
Imrys Profile Options #93

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I would like to see a test:

30% reflect on gear
30% damage reduction vs players via 3pc PVP gears
~30% - from 4x Resolute (? name - the crystal for ~ -7% damage when under 50% for chest)

All that adds up to ~90% damage reduction when under 50% hps.... with 30% being reflected to the attacker... if its straight additive.

Can anyone test this or similar?
crispee Profile Options #94

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Killing priests 1v1 (equal lvl/gear) can be very RNG. As a warrior, I find that they resist stuns the most (with buff + baraka if it applies). Killing them requires a full chain of stuns. If they resist even one of them (and this happens way more than half the time)... its game over for me.

As far as reflect goes in PvP...

It is clear that people here mostly have a problem with it in mass PvP scenarios. I have yet to hear any discussion on the counter argument that was brought up a few posts ago saying that AoE dmg is divided and hits less when spread out among more people, and thus the returned dmg is also less. Even with glyphs introduced, is the lowered returned dmg enough to, as people have been claiming, "one shot" a sorc/zerker that deals divided AoE dmg among several targets. My guess is no but I will probably test this with some friends when I get home from work.

As an anecdotal example, my zerg guild did a gvg with another zerg guild just yesterday. Both guilds are currently riding the FOTM - double stack of reflect on PvP nexus gear. The Sorc in my group was all out AoE'ing and never once died from reflect or got one shot by the result of his own actions. As this is purely anecdotal I can only guess if there were other contributing factors (like the sorcs defenses, good healing in our grp... etc). But as it stands, I have felt no substantial or gamebreaking effect of this stat in mass pvp.

The mass usage of this stat is not a potential scenario for the future, it is happening NOW. Look at most zerg guilds with full nexus PvP gear. Most will have at least 15% reflect.
Inda Profile Options #95

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Could probably do it with vigorous crystals, which are generally best against healers/lancers anyway. But ya, 1v1ing lancers/priests becomes basically impossible thanks to absorbs/heals. I don't really feel it as much on mystics because they don't self heal as well and sorcs I generally haven't noticed much difference if they have reflect.
crispee Profile Options #96

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I've had few opportunities of 1v1 open world fights in this game so far. Even if I did, I probably wouldn't go after a Lancer unless I knew I had the edge somehow or just felt up to the challenge. :-P Mystics I can wear down before they do enough heal/reflect. I can burst down a sorc faster than he can keep me in place to burst me down (and I don't hit them when stoneskin is up). Priests are indeed defensively strong and reflect takes them to near unbeatable, but I personally feel that no one should be able to kill priests 1v1 in open world :-P.
Hissatsu Profile Options #97

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noctred on 06/11/2012, 03:06 PM - view
xDavo420x on 06/11/2012, 02:52 PM

Have never run into a priest I couldn't kill. Warrior here.


Generally speaking, the only priests you're going to kill as a warrior are those who are undergeared relative to you, or those who get cocky and fail to keep themselves topped off because they underestimate potential warrior burst.

As a priest, I think I've only ever lost a duel to a warrior one time - and both of the above conditions applied; he outgeared me and I got a little cocky towards the end, got caught in a well-timed stun, and lost. That same warrior never beat me again.

If priests with decent DR gear are easy for you to kill, I really don't know WTF they're doing. Probably forgot to put guardian sanctuary on their bars?



I stopped reading his post when he made those claims. A warrior killing a geared priest? lol maybe if you're super lucky and he's terrible. A mystic i can see happening but not a priest. If you're willing to unsub because of reflect then something is wrong with you lol. It's NEVER stopped me from taking someone out i wanted to take out. This is the NA community though and all majority of you do is b*tch about something and try to get everything handed to you so w/e lol.
xDavo420x Profile Options #98

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Hissatsu on 06/11/2012, 05:40 PM - view
noctred on 06/11/2012, 03:06 PM
xDavo420x on 06/11/2012, 02:52 PM

Have never run into a priest I couldn't kill. Warrior here.


Generally speaking, the only priests you're going to kill as a warrior are those who are undergeared relative to you, or those who get cocky and fail to keep themselves topped off because they underestimate potential warrior burst.

As a priest, I think I've only ever lost a duel to a warrior one time - and both of the above conditions applied; he outgeared me and I got a little cocky towards the end, got caught in a well-timed stun, and lost. That same warrior never beat me again.

If priests with decent DR gear are easy for you to kill, I really don't know WTF they're doing. Probably forgot to put guardian sanctuary on their bars?



I stopped reading his post when he made those claims. A warrior killing a geared priest? lol maybe if you're super lucky and he's terrible. A mystic i can see happening but not a priest. If you're willing to unsub because of reflect then something is wrong with you lol. It's NEVER stopped me from taking someone out i wanted to take out. This is the NA community though and all majority of you do is b*tch about something and try to get everything handed to you so w/e lol.


I never said "geared" priest. I admitted to not having fought a priest since the PvP gear came out, and I know I would probably never be able to, now; with or without reflect.

BTW, I have killed priests in T12 PvE gear on accident with my backstab burst. Crystal/scroll right and I can do 50k damage in one backstab combo, if I get lucky crits. It's really not that hard. I know I can't do that now with the 30% PvP reduction, and never said I could.

I am not unsubbing because I can't beat people, or even gank someone who is wearing 30%. It's not a prob; and I don't even rock it on my PvP gear.

It's the other things it ruins. I had a 1 v 3 yesterday that lasted like a good 5-6 minutes, in which I ALMOST won. I was literally one CD reset on CoS from pulling that fight off :( (Good fight. Massacre =D ).

Anyway, none of them had the 30%. It was a skill vs skill fight. I lost. But it was fun as all hell. My heart was pumping like no other.... That kind of thrill will not exist when EVERYONE has this 30% reflect.

PvP will become a bland rock, paper, scissors 1 v 1 or group vs group only, stale gameplay. I am not threatening to quit my sub because I want my way. I'm just saying I am losing interest because this stat takes away from variety.

They took my resolute crystals from me (I used to stack 3 resolute and a slaying). That's fine, I can live with that and adapt... I just can't adapt to the reflect. It takes away too much flavor from the game IMO.

You don't have to agree, this is just my opinion and I'm voicing it. At least I'm not trolling on here like so many others.
Ashanor Profile Options #99

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They took my resolute crystals from me (I used to stack 3 resolute and a slaying). That's fine, I can live with that and adapt... I just can't adapt to the reflect. It takes away too much flavor from the game IMO.


You can't stack resolute anymore?
xDavo420x Profile Options #100

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Ashanor on 06/12/2012, 09:31 AM - view
They took my resolute crystals from me (I used to stack 3 resolute and a slaying). That's fine, I can live with that and adapt... I just can't adapt to the reflect. It takes away too much flavor from the game IMO.


You can't stack resolute anymore?


Nah, they took it away with the patch this morning. Kinda sux :(

I'm gonna have to rework my crystals, but I'll find something that works :D

They did, however, make Outlaw a toggle ability.

+10 EME, that was truly an epic move. Very happy with that.